So this has been happening.
(Greg)173. Because the real question was, why would a woman be attracted to an image if it debases her. My point was that it is because she drinks the kool-aid. With a man, the image doesn't give him the message that he is only a sexual object because it is drowned by the images around it. There is no kool-aid to drink. No man looks at our culture and says "wow, we really only value men for their sexual physique". Unless he is retarded.
WHAT THE FUCK?
Who do you think you are to decide what images are quote-unquote debasing to women? Only women themselves have the right to decide that and only on a individual, personal, subjective level based on personal taste which may have nothing to do with feminism and/or sexism. Images you'd like to judge as debasing others might find empowering and arousing or amusing or simply visually pleasant and all sorts of things I bet you can't even imagine, they may hate it for all sorts of reasons you aren't able to take into consideration either. You can't generalize what's appropriate/harmful or not for ALL women--YOU--GREG can't certainly because you are A) male and B) No one ever should. In any context. Because that would be pure sexism.
This however: "...because she drinks the kool-aid." is debasing.
It is debasing because it implies--explicitly--that any woman who doesn't find it debasing is too stupid or brainwashed to realize the impact of all the suggestions and blah blah blah the culture, society, the media, has had on her, so she doesn't reject it but instead internalizes it. But many, many very smart women see those images and enjoy them or ignore them or have any mix of reactions to them and SIMULTANEOUSLY reject all the crap our culture tells them about their worth and value as human begins and as sexual beings and come to their own healthy-happy conclusions based on their own experiences, personality, biology, observations etc etc. Not the conclusions of anyone else, and certainly not the conclusions of what some dude on the internet thinks is the academic-acceptable-non-harmful-mainstream conclusion.
Also how dumb do you think females are Greg? I don't know many who see a picture and think the message they are getting is "Oh that's telling me--more than anything else I should notice in this picture--I'm only worthy as an object of sexual desire". Give us some fucking credit--it's 2011--time for a bit of an outlook update perhaps?
Bottom line is everyone and obviously men included must learn that women themselves--every single one of us--has to come to her own conclusions about what she finds harmful to her psychology and her self-image regardless of what images or media or cultural pressure she is presented with or stumbles across during her life--she can resent that stuff, or ignore it, or try to teach other people to disregard it and evolve beyond it but in the end she'll have to face the fact that she has a body--a body that has historically been controversial and more often than not put her in a position of disadvantage--it is a body that IS different and not the same as men's or as other women's--simple fact of life. Women and men both need to get over this stupid fear of woman's physicality and sexuality and it's manufactured Victorian dangers to individual and society's "long term" health, happiness and stability. It's a fallacy more damaging than some sexy pictures somewhere ever could be.
Interview on Demon City and LotFP
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